How far can you get without advancing levels? I'm finding out you can go pretty far! It started when my Chaotic Neutral party of 5 rogues and Fernok stole the treasure of Rainbow Rock out from under the undead priest. We got the treasure without fighting -- so no experience points. That gave me an idea! After all. I had a band of chaotic neutral rogues that I imagine had dropped out of the Thieves Guild -- a collection of oddballs, 3 w/STRs of 9, 8 & 6 (an elf, gnome & halfling), 1 with CHA 5 (half-orc), and 1 with decent above-average scores (human) . . . well, we don't care about Hommlet's problems with bandits (we ARE bandits, after all) or undead monsters, or village soap opera situations. We want treasure, and we want it without too much trouble 'cause we ain't up to too much fighting. So,we continued sneaking around and we stole the giant's treasure without fighting him or his bear . . . and then we stole Mathel's treasure without fighting him or his top troops . . . and the piece de resistance so far, in the Moathouse we snuck past the Zombies, down the secret passage, snuck into Lareth's room and stole his diary and scrolls without fighting anybody inside the Moathouse. So in all that we only had to fight some skeletons (Emridy Meadow), kobolds (for Mathel's treasure) and the Moathouse bandits that ambush you in the yard (for Lareth's treasure). So at 2nd level I was on my way to Nulb, and after talking to Otis I knew the location of the Temple! Zounds! Now's the tricky part! Can I get the skull and then the throne of gems and move on to Verbobonc before hitting level 5? Adding Wicked to the party brought me up to level 3 -- Temple bugbears are a lot of experience points to a low level party. Getting to the skull and stealing it without a lot of fighting will be a challenge, but that's the fun of it! I wonder if I can steal it without fighting Feldrin? This is becoming an extremely interesting adventure even as i ignore and avoid all the main stories. EDIT: Falrinth, not Feldrin EDIT: Oh yeah, I forgot, when I snuck past the zombies in the Moathouse and went down the secret passage, it dumped me into a fight with the ghouls -- so I did fight something inside the Moathouse.
OK, stole the Skull! Snuck past the Minotaur, snuck past the Lamia, snuck past the Leucrotta, snuck past the Ettin . . . couldn't sneak past the Will-O-Wisps . . . couldn't fight them either at 3rd level and not a single magic weapon . . . so, snuck past the Ettin again and freed Thrommel . . . he killed the Ettin (he can't sneak too well) and the Wisps for me. Then, snuck past Falrinth and stole the Skull, but couldn't open his other chest, then snuck past Smigmal and robbed her chest before leading Thrommel out. So . . . Up to 4th level now (when Thrommel killed the Wisps), and able to go see Zuggy and get the Throne, opening up Verbobonc. If I had been more careful I could probably still be at 3rd level. I have not used invisibility or Fernok's ring. The Elven Cloak (Giant treasure) and Elven Boots (Black Jay) were used when I sent a single rogue into an area. But there were areas where we all had to sneak past, and I only have one cloak and boots. It's been interesting!
Yup a bit buggy. Opening a door into a room should alert the people inside. I am not a very alert guy but if somebody opens the door to my office i Always notice.
Ah, well. I didn't know. Well, it was fun seeing where and what I could get away with. And now I have Verbobonc to play with as well as the rest of the map. My level 4 party has a castle (no ghosts yet) and a permanent room at Tylee's, as well as the Wench. This is also about the only time Wicked would actually be useful to a party. Every other time I ran through the Temple Wicked was a liability so I never took him further than out of the Temple. To be fair about interpreting opening a door to a room in the Temple -- the normal activity, people coming and going is not represented. While it would be harder to traipse around the hallways with bugbears, guards and VIPs walking around, it would be easier to sneak around and into rooms. Perhaps Falrinth was making lunch when I came in, or sleeping. He can't always be standing there doing nothing. And Smigmal living in the middle of an empty room? The femme fatale of the Temple has no furnishings? We have to imagine a lot some times.
A bit of a tangent, but have you considered playing a game where you simulate being sacrificed to the nodes? Always thought it would be cool to stage something like that, e.g. where the temple gangs up on you and forces you to surrender a la grank's bandits. The more lackluster fights in there would suddenly be more meaningful as you are lower level than usual and need to do your best to survive on what resources you have, scouting out and avoiding the tougher enemies, actually recruiting the NPCs in there as replacements for losses, retrieving the holy weapons, and slowly gaining in power until you can take on a guardian. (well, also assuming you don't abuse ToEE's ridiculous sneak system )
I can deal with the sneaking execution in ToEE. It might be better demonstrated in a RL sense by having the sneaker dart from place to place instead of crouch and move slowly, but whatever. Everything's a bit more extreme in the D&D world obviously, so the notion that someone could sneak in and out of a room undetected isn't that hard for me to swallow. (And some doors do open silently.)
I hadn't thought much on it -- it had crossed my mind as I thought about the others stranded there. It's a bit hard to imagine with the nodes set up as they are. If they were bigger, and had a more diversified RE list . . . yes. And, of course, more dialog leading to different situations. It might be a real cool scenario. I am trying to get my party of low-level rogues there, but getting past the electric trap is difficult for them. The trolls died rather than give up the password, and sneaking in to get a scarab doesn't seem likely -- and there's no way they can fight their way in. I tried going from the Interdicted Level to the circular back room on Level 4, and then sneaking to the nodes -- but getting past the puddings and slimes seems impossible. I can sneak past the mushroom fungi but not the slimes and puddings. There are definitely places a low-level rogue cannot sneak past. Some creatures, like Will-O-Wisps and the slimes/etc, are just too aware (and different, I guess), and some rooms have too many beings in them -- one is sure to make a lucky roll and alert the rest to the party of rogues sneaking through. The fewer the beings in sight the easier to sneak. That's one reason to post temple guards outside VIP quarters, and high-level VIPs would have guards that have the appropriate skills -- not your cookie-cutter variety grunt. I've been thinking about creating a small scenario add-on, and if it works and I have the time then expanding it. I'll finish up the portrait pack I did, and then fiddle with a scenario. It'll be something a whole lot easier than the nodes, though! I like 8.1.0 NC -- thank you for the small leather and padded, the masterwork versions and the masterwork silver mace. Those might seem like small things (pun not intended) but they mean a lot to the Little People I adventure with -- especially when STR is around 6. I see you've tightened up some areas as regards to NPC placement, and tightened up some dialog -- all very good. Thank you!
Not at all. Very smooth. I am able to get out of the circular room (still sneaking from the Interdicted Level), into the fungus room where I can open all the chests -- unable to disable the traps though, so some fungi die from "friendly fire" and the rest don't rouse (they actually should). But then when trying to exit that room there seems to be no way past the puddings and slimes. I tried sneaking out of combat -- i.e. running away on the first move while still sneaking like I did in Emridy Meadows, but the black pudding ain't fooled so easily. And once combat starts everybody else wakes up -- and it's all over for the low-level rogues. But no lag.
